As a cart boy in high school, Robert Kleckner never dreamed he would own a golf club. He knew he had an entrepreneurial spirit but the destination was unclear. Listen to learn his journey through varied jobs which he characterizes and training for a marathon until he actually ran it. He learned the value of networking and turned it to his benefit. What a story! Robert is truly one of the luckiest people in the world. Learn more about The Luckiest Guys in the World at www.theluckiestguyintheworld.com
Reach Robert at Linfield National Golf Club: www.linfieldnational.com
TRANSCRIPT
Diane Dayton 0:02
This is Changing the Rules. A podcast about designing the life you want to live, hosted by KC Dempster and Ray Loewe, the luckiest guy in the world.
KC Dempster 0:13
Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Changing the Rules. This is KC Dempster and Ray Loewe is with me and we are speaking to you from Wildfire Podcast Studios in beautiful downtown Woodbury. And I have to say, it is a beautiful, beautiful day on unlikely weather for November, but I am embracing it. Because I'm one of the luckiest people in the world. And I planned my life to be this way.
Ray Loewe 0:43
Okay, good for you. You know, I you mentioned that we're sitting here at beautiful Wildfire Podcast Studios. And I need to make a quick comment about this, because Wildfire has been a wonderful partner with us. You know, we started doing podcasts a little over a year ago, we had no experience, we had no idea what we're doing. We still don't know what we're doing. Okay,
KC Dempster 1:07
Speak for yourself.
Ray Loewe 1:08
But But what happened here is that Wildfire led us through the process. And we have a comfortable situation right now. We come down here every other Tuesday and, and record and our engineer Taylor has been wonderful and the people that we've been dealing with has been wonderful. So you know, if you're thinking about doing a podcast at some point in time, start with Wildfire. It's, it's it's a you'll never leave. Right? Okay. All right. So we have a guest today. His name is Robert Kleckner. And, Robert. Just say hi. You're not on yet. But say hi.
Robert Kleckner 1:45
Good morning, everybody.
Ray Loewe 1:47
You had to change it Didn't you see? See Robert is one of those who changes the rules. Yeah. All right. And he'll do whatever he wants to do. So when we have this podcast called Dhanging the Rules, it is based around some of the luckiest people in the world. And we define the luckiest people in the world as those people who plan and design their own life. And then they step into it, and they make it work. Right. And you're gonna see in a couple minutes as we go through Robert's story here that he is very definitely one of the luckiest people in the world. And let's start with a quick break here, Taylor, and then we're gonna move right into our interview with Robert.
Diane Dayton 2:31
You're listening to changing the rules with KC Dempster and Ray Loewe, the luckiest guy in the world. We will be right back with more exciting information.
Ray Loewe 2:41
Okay, I'm on right, KC?
KC Dempster 2:43
Yes.
Ray Loewe 2:43
Okay. All right. So I had the opportunity to meet Robert a good 20 plus years ago, okay. And Robert was at that time, a professional golfer, he still is a professional golfer. But over over time, Robert made some strategic moves with I, which changed his life, it's gonna change his family's life very much for the positive, because he's done all the things that the luckiest people in the world to do. So Robert, say hello again. And talk to me a little bit about Linfield National in a general sense, and then we'll get into how you managed to wind up there.
Robert Kleckner 3:27
Well, good morning, everybody. And it is an absolutely beautiful day, inside and out. And a little bit about Linfield National Golf Course. So I've been at Linfield for 19 years now, an 18 hole public golf course, located right up before 22, Carter, probably about 15 miles from King of Prussia. And it opened in 1997. And as I said, I've been here since '01. So it's been a tremendous, tremendous facility and place to say I come to work every day.
Ray Loewe 4:03
Well, I think it's a little more than just coming to work because you actually own Linfield Golf Course, don't you?
Robert Kleckner 4:11
That's correct. So I arrived here in '01 prior to 9/11. And I owned another 9 hole facility at the time. And I sold that and I came in here with two builders. And I ran a couple facilities for the builders. And then in '08, you know, things went sideways, and for building and construction and the economy and I took a negative and turned it into an opportunity. And then in 2012 I settled on the facility. And from that point on, I've been the sole owner of the property and the golf course.
Ray Loewe 4:54
Okay, so let's break this thing into two pieces because I think you have two lives here. One is you're a professional golfer, right? And number two, you're an entrepreneur. Okay? So So let's talk about this entrepreneur kind of a thing, because here you are, I know, I helped you go through this. But it was 20 years ago, and you had this opportunity to purchase this golf course. And what kind of goes through your head or went through your head, when you had to make these decisions and, and take some risk in order to get the rewards that you want to get?
Robert Kleckner 5:35
Yeah, so there's many, many, you know, paths or rivers, or everyone explain why this, why this happened. So in '08-09, they were looking, they stopped building things were going very into the economy for the construction was was not in a very good state. And they stopped paying me here. So I was looking at, at possibly getting out of golf business totally. The head professional jobs are few and far between, you know, we're in an oversaturated market at the time of golf courses. And, and I wanted to go primarily into back into the private sector, to be head professional, which that's where I came from. And I looked at other jobs outside of the golf business, whether it was going to be with with gambling, or Wawa or financial institution, insurance company, a lot of people had opportunities for me to, to segue out of the golf industry, and, and go into a different line of work totally, but still using my skills of dealing with people. And I think that's kind of how this all kind of transpired and formed out. So I decided to take it upon myself, I talked to my wife, and she said, I was crazy. Um, when she tells me that a lot, and I went out looking for banks, which in '08, '09, no one wanted, no one would touch this place with a 10 foot pole, or, or six, or in these times six feet. So no one would touch me. And so I shopped the banks. But I shopped the banks, like, I wanted them, I was interviewing them, and then instead of them interviewing me, and in that perspective, I had a lot of banks come back to me. And then I signed an agreement of sale in 2011. And settled in 2012, and then 2013, the economy and everything else started turning in the right direction. And so my toughest obstacle, I'm doing this by myself and not going for any other partners or anyone else. For funds or funding. The toughest thing was the was the hurdle, the bank, but I established a great relationship with a small bank, and still customer to this day. And that's kind of you know, in a quick, quick story on how that all work. There was many, many things I was told 20 times, I couldn't do it. I was told no by many, many people, this isn't going to work, you're not going to be able to do this. But I never stopped trying. Um, and I think that was the biggest thing is I never took no for an answer. And yes, I am a golf professional, and an entrepreneur but I always say I'm an entrepreneur that ended up being a golf professional. So I always had this in me um, I always had ownership, I always had business sense. I always had wanted to own something, whether it was a Life is Good t shirt store to a candy shop that I I found down in, in in in Kiowah Island, I thought was amazing. So just something like that. And I don't think I set like a passing Oh, I'm going to own a golf course one day, I think just all the hard work on the day to day, day to day day to day, like training for a marathon. You train every day. And then you go out and you run it and I trained every day not realizing I can run it and and it all came through. And a lot of good people I worked at three high end private country clubs around the Philadelphia area and my network is phenomenal. And I never even knew what the word network meant. Or until I got through at all. And I've tremendous amount of people that you can say network I call them friends, friend work. I think they're they're all they're all friends of mine. I could pick up the phone at all levels in the in the community around Philadelphia. And it's pretty cool. I've been as I said, lucky I am lucky. I love coming to work every day. I go on vacation. and I miss this Place. So super fortunate. But I have a great, great family foundation with my parents, and then my wife and my two children, which everyone's always been so supportive, and I think that makes makes it a lot easier being in the golf business or running any business. The Home Front, you know, some days, the business comes first, some days, I come first some days, the family comes first. And I think that's the balance in any successful relationship business. Friendship, there has to be a balance, because it goes one sided one way some one of those areas will and definitely will suffer.
KC Dempster 10:39
Right? Right. Just this is an aside, do either one of your children play golf.
Robert Kleckner 10:45
Ah, my son just started.
KC Dempster 10:48
And how old is he,
Robert Kleckner 10:49
He is a three sport athlete. He is 15. And then he, he actually made the varsity team, but he you know, he just you know, he's a three sport athlete, and he just picked it up. But they, they, they both this was definitely a home for them for COVID they came up here door and the closing show, they were super blessed. Even though I was closed for seven and a half weeks, from March until May 1, they came up here I still came to work every day. As as so I was blessed. I wasn't open. But we did a lot of projects, the kids could do stuff, they could get on on on their laptops and do school from, you know, from from here. And then when we opened we just, you know, then they were they put some hours in because the sports were basically all canceled. And so they had a lot of time. So they were they were blessed by being and I was blessed to have them be here around me and being able to work and being able to get out and you know, be a little social as best they could not around their friends and peers at school, but at least they had an opportunity. So So back to the question, Bobby does play a little golf. Wendy does play a little and Addie does play little. So they all play a little bit. But they they don't. You know, they, they have their own little paths that they're looking at, which is great. Yeah, which I want them. I want them to create their own path. Sure, I don't want them to create a path for them to come back and say, Okay, I'm gonna run this golf course you take it over, if they finish all their schooling, and they get all the right things in line, and they come back and they want to purchase this from me, then then that would be an option. But other than that, they they're gonna come up with their own careers at this point,
KC Dempster 12:37
right? It has to be their choice.
Ray Loewe 12:38
Cool. You know, let's take a minute and talk a little bit about golf as a sport, because I know when I was growing up, it was the it was the sport of country clubs, okay. And a lot of people I know, played all the time, it was a major thing to do. And then, several years ago, I heard that golf was kind of losing its esteem. Because it's so complicated. And if you're going to be any good at the sport, you got to play a lot. And it was frustrating to a lot of people me, especially by the way, okay. And I understand they were taking golf courses, and they were turning them into different kinds of things. So So what's happening with the sport of golf right now? And where is it going? And how is this gonna affect you going forward?
Robert Kleckner 13:26
Well, I definitely think what has happened since May 1, when we reopened in the state of Pennsylvania, it definitely was a shot of steroid into the golf industry, because the first thing they opened was fishing in Pennsylvania, and then that, and then the next thing was was, was golf. So there wasn't there's three things to do walk in the park, go play golf, or go fishing. So it definitely brought a lot of people back into the sport. I think what happened after there's three booms that I that I've lived through is when I was a young kid, I was a cart kid, and in, you know, the late 80s, early 90s, the AOL tech boom of golf, and then the Tiger boom, and the Tiger boom caused a big influx of golfers but also it caused a big influx of golf courses. So when we after 9/11, we had golf decreasing and an oversaturated market with golf courses. So I think the good thing that has happened since '01-'02 in the Bucks County and Montgomery and Philadelphia area, Westchester area. We've lost golf courses for good reason. So the saturation of golf courses. Is is going down the saturation of golf courses that were in Arizona or the Carolinas or Florida that had construction attached to them. They kind of just went away or plowed over We're in the Philadelphia area. golf courses went away for great reasons the hospital Einstein hospital. We had a couple of developments. Toll Brothers have Ocean Valley, Limekilm, Center Square Phoenixville, a school district, took over Bank of America up to up in Allentown area got another golf course. So we lost a lot of golf course. So back to that. So are we're getting back to a normal inventory or some kind of a normal ratio of golfers to golf courses in the Philadelphia area, which is definitely an asset for private clubs, resorts or public facilities. So I do see golf, I mean it is it is going up, you know, it's just like the market, it's going to correct itself. If it's not sustainable, it's not going to be like this. Next year, it may be a little bit less, but I think there's going to be a lot of people that are going to stay in it. And I think it's the you know, the Generation X and the millenniums or whatever, whatever age category you want to talk about, I think the biggest thing with golf was time. And that's number one. And the other thing with golf is the average golfer back in the 80s used to play 2.5 times a week now the golf average golfer, average golfer plays point five. And because the husband and wife work, you know, little Johnny and Susie play games every Saturday. I mean, you can play baseball year round soccer all year round, field hockey all year round. So lacrosse all year round. So a lot of the weekends are getting sucked up by you know, the husband and wives that can't get out on Saturdays. Now they're going through the games. So that's where this the COVID and the lack, you know, the cut back on the sports and stuff, help some of some of the golfers to play more and I see a lot more youth playing golf, which is phenomenal. I know our youth programs or high school programs are pretty competitive. You know they have cut in golf programs up and up in this area in the past which is Methacten and then Springfield and Phoenixville and Norristown and PV and and Owen j Roberts up in this net. And so that was that was never, that was never an issue. They're always looking for golfers to play these teams or play on the high school team. So you can definitely see the younger generation and it is a lifetime sport. And I can't tell you how many countless athletes where people doesn't they don't necessarily the athletes come through and say, Man, I wish I would have started earlier. I wish I would have you know, started playing because it is a great sport to continue to play as you age up through through your life.
Ray Loewe 17:47
Yeah. So I wish I would have started playing early. Enjoy fit now. Am I part of the group?
Robert Kleckner 17:55
Okay, it's never too late. It's never too late to start.
Ray Loewe 17:59
Okay, well, well at 104. Okay, I, you know, maybe I can pick up a golf club, though. But But, I mean, I think you're right. I think golf is here. I think it's a question of what you guys do to the youth movement too, to keep it going. Let me ask you a couple of other questions, because I know you've put in other things other than golf. So you start with the golf course. And I think you did some things with cell towers and you did some things with indoor golf kinds of things. Talk to us about some of the entrepreneurial moves that you made as far as your organization is concerned.
Robert Kleckner 18:40
Yes, so you know, anything with you know, originally I worked in the ski business all through high school and college at ski shop and work as a cart kid. And and I always thought I'd be out in Denver working a ski resort in the wintertime and and golf course in the summertime and then eventually one of the design ski boots and be a doctor, Podiatrist and things like that? That was my original thoughts in high school. So when I took over this business, I knew I saw businesses that were seasonal and how, how much of a challenge it is. So I figured I figured out when I'm taking over this facility, I got to figure out how to out what do we do in the book ends? What do I do before and after daylight savings? What do I do at night? What can I do here? And I thought about some things some things did stick and some things didn't. The first thing is the cell tower, which was probably one of my other than, you know, getting married and having kids while a major and graduating college is one of my major accomplishments because literally I talked about being told no, no. When I first took over here I called every cell tower company that I could find and They all told me we you don't call us we call you. So like. Okay. So they said, I said, Okay, well then what do I do for you to call me? And they said, Well, yeah, you have to register your property and, and so on and so forth. So, so I did that. And then it was like a sleeping, you know, Sleeping Bear for about a year and a half, and then all of a sudden, my phone blew up. So I got some calls, and I had a young guy come drive down from New York City, I was his very first customer just started with. the company. And he made it, his, he put it on his platform that I was going to get one, you know, and it's very difficult to get one if you you know, different townships and different restrictions and different heights, and neighborhoods and, and, and of course, you know, the local governments like to have them because of the revenue, which is great. Whether it's the police or fire companies or township buildings, so you know, your, your battle on that, because you have to get it through the township to get it passed. So, um, but I, you know, I've always had great relationships, wherever, wherever I, everywhere I worked, I worked, like I owned the facility, even though I didn't. So I always establish really good relationships with people. And I did a lot of good things in the community always volunteered. And I'm not saying I didn't give to get, but I always gave, and it seems to come around full circle 10-15-20 years later, so that I got it all, you know, took me four years to get it through. So it was not an easy process by any means. And so that was one of them. That was a good accomplishment. Second thing is, uh, I took 3000 square feet of my indoor Golf Club of my clubhouse. And I turned this is seven years ago. This is way before it's hot right now. I mean, golf simulators are the hottest thing in the market right now in the industry, just because of the technology. And, and of course, knowing people want these in their homes, because they, you know, they, they can't do too much at the time back in the fall and early like March and April. And then this winter, you know, everyone wants them in their own home if they can't, if they can't get out. So we built six of them in here, which bridged my basically November for the next six months. So so you can come and play you know, you can play Pebble Beach, you can play Merion, you can play Linfield indoor. And it's a pretty, pretty cool thing. So that that was that was that was really exciting to do that. So
Ray Loewe 22:42
cool. Well, you know, it's all good things happen when we come to the end of our time. And we actually are over our time over here, Robert, but your story is a wonderful story. No, you're forgiven. But your story is a wonderful story. And I think we can all see why Robert is one of the luckiest people in the world. And some of the things that he's done the perseverance, the the being of unafraid to take some reasonable risks and things like that to expand your business and do things and we're going to have to have you on again, and you're going to have to get me out and teach me how to play golf so that I can enter into the world of old age, you know, with my second sport here, Robert? So so
Robert Kleckner 23:24
well, one quick thing, right? First ages and number lights and attitude. That's I love to say that and number two, you were a great inspiration, many breakfast meetings with you about all kinds of stuff. So you were part of my path to success with some of your guidance. Thank you.
Ray Loewe 23:45
Well, thanks for being you. And we'll have you back at sometime soon. So we're at the end of our show, KC. You know, one quick thing I want to remind everybody of is December 2 is our virtual conference. You can register on our website. And if you want to get in touch with Robert, we'll put his website in our podcast notes, so you're going to be able to reach him and everybody get out and play golf. It's a safe sport today. So thanks for being with us.
Diane Dayton 24:14
Thank you for listening to Changing the Rules, a podcast designed to help you live your life the way you want, and give you what you need to make it happen. Join us in two weeks for our next exciting topic on changing the rules with KC Dempster and Ray Loewe luckiest guy in the world.