"Even coaches need a coach." With this statement, Bill Hughes shares wisdom gained from his experiences at both a coach and coachee, if that's a word. From accountability to making choices, Bill has great insight that everyone can benefit from. Here's something to chew on, "What's right is not always best." Bill inspires thought and reflection that can ultimately put you on a path to taking control of your life and becoming one of the luckiest people in the world. Learn more at www.theluckiestpeopleintheworld.com
Reach Bill at: w.hughes@verizon.net
TRANSCRIPTION:
Diane Dayton 0:02
This is Changing the Rules. A podcast about designing the life you want to live, hosted by KC Dempster and Ray Loewe, the luckiest guy in the world.
KC Dempster 0:11
Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Changing the Rules. I'm KC Dempster. And I'm here with Ray Loewe in the wonderful Wildfire Podcasting Studios in beautiful downtown Woodbury, New Jersey.
Ray Loewe 0:26
Yeah, remember that wonderful?
KC Dempster 0:28
Well, that's why I put it in there. It's all that alliteration.
Yes, yes. So good morning, this morning, we're going to speak with an old friend, Bill Hughes. And he's got a lot of interesting things to say. So what's up Ray?
Ray Loewe 0:31
Well, it's it is alliteration. But it actually is wonderful. Because when we started podcasting, about a year ago, we had no clue as to what was going on. And without the people here at Wildfire Podcasting Studios, we just wouldn't have had a clue. I'm not sure we. We have a clue now. But we have leadership to take us through. That's true. So wildfire has done a wonderful job for us.
Well, Bill Hughes is a longtime acquaintance. He's a longtime friend, maybe a little less longtime friend, but a longtime friend. And on he very definitely is one of the luckiest people in the world, because he designs his own life personally. And then he lives it the way he wants to live it. And one of the interesting things about Bill is that he doesn't always seem certain that he is one of the luckiest people in the world. But but that's because he is always searching to find out who he is so that he can be better. And he is certainly on this journey. And because it's on its journey, that's what locks him in is one of the luckiest people in the world. So Bill, whether you like it or not, you're here and you are. So say hello, and introduce yourself quickly. And let's start talking.
Bill Hughes 2:03
Well, I'm Bill Hughes, and I'm here and I am considered one of the luckiest people in the world. As write me, and you acknowledge it this morning, this is this is a really good start.
Ray Loewe 2:14
Okay. So So, Bill Hughes, I've known for 30, some years, he has always been a mentor to me and kind of a coach to me. And I think the difference the difference between mentor and coaches, coaches get paid mentors do it for free so you're a mentor Bill
Yeah, let's keep it that way. And let's start with with an interesting concept about you, because you're an outstanding coach, who always believes he needs a coach. Yes, so comment on that a little bit?
Bill Hughes 2:52
Well, there's very few people in this world that I've run into, that can self coach, because it's so easy to lie to yourself, hmm. And if you really want to make progress, you need an accountability partner. And if you can find somebody skilled in the field of coaching, to help you with that, in your particular direction, I think you'll find a lot more success than if you try and do it on your own. And to be a coach. It's difficult, I think, to advocate for coaching, if you are unwilling to be coached.
KC Dempster 3:24
Yeah, there there, there is a certain resistance on some people's part because they secretly think that they don't really need it.
Ray Loewe 3:30
Yeah, they know it all. And, and, and it's not knowing it all, it's not the skill set as much as the accountability. So so let's keep that in mind as we go through our conversation today. Because that, that's one of the keys that you bring to the table. One of the things I know about you is that you are always searching to dig deeper into who you are, and why you're here. So you have any comments on that at all?
Bill Hughes 4:00
Well, yeah, it's a it's been a constant Trek, no matter what I think if you stop growing, then you're dead. So as I see it anyway, it's a it's a pursuit that pretty much everybody is on whether they realize it or not. You're not the same person, you were 10 minutes ago, let alone 10 years ago. So that's, that's something I think that has a great deal of, of gravity in and of itself. I've read most of the, the, the classics that talk about the inner thought and how one should one should be and, and it's just a great way to start because you figure, anybody that puts pen to paper and writes a book or a series of books on the topic, they've clearly put some life into it. And why reinvent the wheel when it's so much easier to hear what somebody else has to say. about it. And then at some point, I think everybody has a book get him somewhere. It's just a matter of putting pen to paper. So I'm still looking, because I think there's so much more I need to know.
Ray Loewe 5:13
I think I think you're there Bill write the book. Okay, so we had a pre interview a while ago, and you made a bunch of statements, and I wrote them all down. And we're gonna kind of go through them. But the one I'd like to start with is that you made a comment that most people self select out of being the luckiest people in the world.
Bill Hughes 5:37
It's true, I think, I think that it's, like I said, about the coaching thing and having an accountability partner. How many times has somebody come to you and said, Well, that was really great, or they they acknowledged some aspect of you that stands out. And you immediately take the line of humility by saying, Oh, no, no, it's just the way things are. And, again, that's the start of setting up the boundaries so that you don't have to test the water and go somewhere where it might be a little bit more, more or less unclear as to what you're going to get when you when you get there. So I think people always are challenged by their expectations. And if their expectations for themselves, or rather limited, then that's as far as they're going to go. Well,
KC Dempster 6:30
don't you also think that there's there is a definite personality within certain people that is so change resistant, that they even though they they think that they want to be something else, or someone else, they're they're totally unwilling to embrace what they have to do to get there. And that's what I how I just defined self selecting out.
Bill Hughes 6:55
Yeah, that there's, there's a lot, there's a lot there, because again, we are an ensemble of belief systems. And depending on how deeply ingrained those are, in your own personal system, are going to determine whether or not you can challenge some of those things and think about something else. And think about what other possibilities might be.
Ray Loewe 7:15
Well, and this is why I think you need a coach in life, I have a coach, okay, actually, I have multiple coaches, and I keep changing them and getting new ones. And it's not because one is bad. It that, You have changing needs, and you have changing time periods in your life where you need different skill sets and different thought processes. So so let's go through a couple of things that distinguish you as a coach, I think and not all of them are coaching kind of things. But let me go through them and get your comments on them. As far as self selecting out of being the luckiest people in the world, one of your comments that you always bring up is that you always have a choice choice. Right? Absolutely. And yet, I think a lot of us don't think we have a choice sometimes so. So why do you always have a choice? And how do you latch on to that and as part of your life, so that you always have fresh options in front of you?
Bill Hughes 8:16
Well, the the comment that you always have a choice is true to the extent that if you self select out, you've made a choice. Right? Oh, you're making a choice. Right? And all I'm suggesting is that you can choose something else if if you desire to do so because you do have that choice. And then the question always comes back as to what the ramifications are of those choices. And again, that's something that you can explore with an accountability person, whether it's a mentor or a coach, or however you want to go about it, but at the same time, I think that that that really makes the the argument that you always have a choice because those choices that you have selected, whether they be confining, and within the boundaries of what you understand to be the outcomes you desire. They are still choices all the same.
KC Dempster 9:11
Yeah, I used to I think I mentioned in the, in our call last week that with my children, if I told them to do something and they didn't do the do it. I tried to point out to them that they just made a choice, and they've chosen the consequences. And they you know, I hope they got it they didn't seem to get it then but maybe as they got more mature they did
Ray Loewe 9:31
well and the other thing is if you don't like your coach, you can always upgrade to the psychiatrist realm of things here too. Okay, so so you just said so many really good things. Let me hit you with another one that you brought up. And and that is what's right is not always what's best. This is pretty deep Bill even for you. It's pretty deep. So So what do you mean and how do we apply this to our lives here?
Bill Hughes 9:57
Well, I guess When you think about it, have you ever told a white lie?
KC Dempster 10:04
More than likely,
Ray Loewe 10:06
and mine are always black lies
Bill Hughes 10:09
Some people, some people see truth as the absolute, and that that's something that we always have to adhere to. And I think that's something that we can contain within ourselves. But there's times when that may not necessarily be the thing that's called for particularly if somebody's like, somebody's very close to you asks to how they look. Yeah,
KC Dempster 10:28
do these pants make me look fat?
Bill Hughes 10:30
Right, there you go. The second you move down the path of truth, you are rough that relationship for certain?
Ray Loewe 10:40
so much. So you're giving me permission to lie here, Bill? Well, I,
Bill Hughes 10:45
you know, I guess that's, that's the the, the, the limitations of our language, I think you have to ascertain, in the circumstances, what is best for the circumstance that you are wrestling with the time. And sometimes what is best is not always what is right.
Ray Loewe 11:05
And yet, we overlook that because we're all trying to be perfect people. Right, KC,
KC Dempster 11:10
I don't try for perfection anymore. All
Ray Loewe 11:12
right. Talk, go go back to this absolute truth piece that we avoid a lot of times, because one of the comments that you made, again, during our pre interview is that the Absolute Truth never changes.
Bill Hughes 11:26
That's true.
Ray Loewe 11:29
Okay, so how do we wrestle with this, we have this thing called the absolute truth that never changes. We know that sometimes. doing what's right is not always doing what's best. Hi, how do we how do we wrestle with all this in our lives, because this is what our our podcasts are all about. It's about changing the rules. And, and in your coaching experience, I mean, give us some examples of some of the times that you have to coach people to really think about what's right, not what's best, or what's best, not what's right, or whatever.
Bill Hughes 12:08
Well, I think it comes down to the constant wrestle we have with integrity, the those kinds of things. So when you are called upon to make a decision that you find yourself in some sort of conflict over. In particular, it could be well, I know from the professional side, I've had, I've witnessed it, where somebody goes in for tax advice, and the tax advice would lean a person in one particular direction, because that is the best the most palatable way to save money on taxes, at the same time of the transaction that they were considering that might violate that might be better to make because of some other thing that has to do, say, with family. An example was the one that I use, which might be beyond the technical scope of this conversation, but that of a family bank as an example. There are very wealthy families that want to do for their kids. And, and they would possibly consider setting up a family bank to do that. And an accountant might go through the roof over something like that, because again, it's not the most tax efficient way to, to preserve one's taxes. So in that particular case, the family decides to go forward with a bank because it's what's best for their family. It may not be what's right for their taxes.
Ray Loewe 13:33
Okay, so what you're saying here is that coaching gets to be confusing, and that the Absolute Truth is not always the right thing. It never changes. But do we have to think around this stuff? So sorry. So you had a number of other statements? Right, I've got so many statements, we'll never get through them and I have and the period of time that we have, but you talk about does it feel right, a lot? I guess that's a continuation of the statement you were just trying to make?
Bill Hughes 14:03
Right? Well, there are certain social situations too where one has to curtail maybe the direction they might want to go in from the standpoint that they would be stating an absolute truth, but it might be one that would be disruptive in that particular circumstance. It doesn't mean you give up the truth, but it does mean that you might you might hold back on on on your pronouncements if for no other reason to preserve social interaction into a way that's more beneficial in the moment.
Ray Loewe 14:41
Okay, when when you're coaching somebody, and I think this is critical, because coaches are all different. What what are the major things that you look for in a client, I'm sure you get clients that you find you can't help sometimes, and yet here you are. You got to realize friendship with them. What do you do in these cases?
Bill Hughes 15:04
Well, it depends. I mean, there are circumstances when coaching is the thing that's really required where you might need something that is a little bit more therapeutic, in which case, sitting down with a psychologist or a psychiatrist might be a better opportunity. There, there are times when when in coaching, you encounter a circumstance that, that requires that kind of professional therapeutic approach, in which case, as a coach, you have to recognize when you're in over your head with an individual, and then again, that that the challenge then is how to get them to seek the kind of help that they need to achieve the outcomes that they're really trying to get to realizing again, that there might be something organic that's interfering, and I don't have the tools for that so consequentially, I'll look for somebody else that has a different professional range and area of expertise to, to encourage that individual to pursue that direction as opposed to a coach.
Ray Loewe 16:07
Okay, let's change direction a little bit over here. And again, this is all part of the coaching that you go through. And I think what makes you both a good coach and one of the luckiest people in the world, but but you're talking about wrestling with our own boundaries. And I think, I think that's has a lot to do with the luckiest people in the world. So So what do you mean by that and and to go one further, you tallk about feeling safe?
Bill Hughes 16:37
Well, the two are not mutually exclusive. Safety, again, is a perception. But as a coach, you want to make the circumstances safe, so the individual can help you help them. And to that extent, safety becomes an extraordinary issue. As far as boundaries are concerned, a lot of those are based on artificial belief systems that we have, where we've been inculcated socially over the years to think a certain way and beliefs are not always true. So that's where my objective with somebody who's got destructive belief systems that that are preventing them from realizing who they are as a human being, to take them a little bit further and get them to test the water outside their, their comfort, their comfort zone as it relates to their belief systems.
Ray Loewe 17:29
All right, so I've kind of in my own way, taking you in a convoluted path over here. So so let me let me sum up with some things that, that I think you said today that are significant. Let's start out with the fact that we all need to know who we are. And this is a journey, there's because the situation changes all of the time. One of one of the things that can help us know who we are, is a good coach. And even those of us who are coaches or consider ourselves coaches need coaches. Okay. Am I on the right track? so far? Bill?
Bill Hughes 18:07
Yep. so far.
Ray Loewe 18:08
Okay. Then there are some things that come into play here. And it seems to me that a lot of the things that we're talking about are not less than necessarily skill, building kinds of things. They're the internal kinds of things that that keep us from doing what we really want to do. So we get in here, we need to remember that we always have a choice and that these choices have consequence, right? Yes. And I think a lot of the way you help people do things here is that people need to realize that what's right is not always what's best. And sometimes we have those little white lies in there that need to be part of part of things. You talk a lot about feelings here and do things feel right. And then we get into this concept of our boundaries. You know, it's this idea of, if we want to be one of the luckiest people in the world, we often have to extend ourselves until we wrestle with these boundaries, because we've had sets of rules that have always bothered us. And to cross the boundary, sometimes you gotta feel safe. And I'm not sure how you do that. But are we on the right track so far? Here?
Bill Hughes 19:28
Yeah. So far, I would suggest on the on the safety side. It's always incremental. I mean, you don't just jump into a pool of cold water. When you're getting ready to go into the pool during the summer, you might test it with your feet first. So always take things to a level that allow you to incrementally move forward. So I think that's part of it as well.
Ray Loewe 19:49
Okay. So I think you know what, what I'm trying to get out of this thing is you've always been a mentor to me in every state of Your life when you were doing different things at different times, you were always welcome into my office because you always brought unique thought patterns and unique ideas and sometimes unique information. But but i think i think that the real benefit that I've always saw seen in you is these things that we've talked about today. I didn't realize I was getting a coach when you came into my office, but I was okay. because it gave me the idea to bounce off ideas and feelings off of you. And, and they were some of the most valuable things that I think helped us continue over relationship for 30 some years. I mean, it's almost like we're married bill.
KC Dempster 20:42
One of the things that I really like is that, that as a coach, Bill said, Sometimes he can't always help, but he hopes to leave things better than he found them.
Bill Hughes 20:53
Right? Yeah, that's, that's a, that's a big, that's a, that's a big thing right there. There are times when you cannot remedy the situation. But you can leave it better than you found it so that you, as an example, when I suggest when I can't help somebody in coaching, it may not be that they need to talk to a head shrink, or that sort of thing, it could very well be that they need different kind of coach, in which case, by my directing them into that into that path. I've left them better than I found them on the call. So I didn't just excuse them and and go on to my next, my next phone call, I would typically attempt to leave them something to do to to possibly move the marble a little bit far more forward for themselves.
Ray Loewe 21:41
Okay, well, unfortunately, Bill, we are near the end of our time framework here. Is there anything you want to say to kind of sum up because I think your coaching philosophy came out today really well? Any final comment?
Bill Hughes 21:55
Yeah, I'd say just just a quote that I've always tried to remember from a mentor coach that I that I took from, more or less a writing, I was not coached by sky directly. Wayne Dyer is an excellent author, if anybody's read any of his stuff at all. But one thing he left him with over the years, it's always served me extremely well, I think might be the best way to sum this up. "When you have a choice between being right or being kind always choose kindness." Hmm. Yeah.
Ray Loewe 22:27
And sometimes that means not telling the Absolute Truth. Right?
Bill Hughes 22:32
Well, that just simply means doing the best thing at the moment.
Ray Loewe 22:36
Okay, great. I think that quote, at the end is the great place to leave. And, you know, thank you for being you. Thank you for being part of our luckiest people in the world community. And we're gonna talk more over the years. So, KC, you want to show up for
KC Dempster 22:52
us? Yes, we have a great podcast coming up next week with another old friend. And so it's worth listening to. He's done some very interesting things in his career. And come back next week and meet our new our new guest. Right,
Ray Loewe 23:13
everybody have a great week.
Diane Dayton 23:16
Thank you for listening to Changing the Rules, a podcast designed to help you live your life the way you want, and give you what you need to make it happen. Join us in two weeks for our next exciting topics on changing the rules with KC Dempster and Ray Loewe the luckiest guy in the world.